Take 2?

AblitERateOR · Post by **AblitERateOR** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 6:16 am

as far as i know it was just windows

Post by **Myrd** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:07 am

It was Windows. How it went was thus: You go install Myth II. The Installer selects C:\Program Files\Myth II as the destination location. You change it to C:\. It installs all the Myth files in the top directory on your hard drive. You go to uninistall, and the uninstaller deletes the whole directory where Myth II was installed. This happened to be C:\, so your hard drive is formatted now, GG.

What's interesting is until recently, the Firefox installer had the same bug, and the devs didnt fix it until 1.5 I think. Which was tons of time of distributing Firefox 1.0 (and minor updates which needed a re-install), with the same uninstall bug as Myth II had. Bungie on the other hand decided to do a full recall and destroy all the CDs and reprint them. This costed them so much money, that they _needed_ someone to invest in them to recuperate the cost ... and that's where Take2 came in.

GodzFire · Post by **GodzFire** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 2:06 pm

Of course it was Windows. What doesn't mess it up?

As far as Take2, gotta say thanks to them for essentially pissing on the series that I've gotten so much enjoyment from.

Lugas · Post by **Lugas** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 3:20 pm

You can't put all the blame on T2. They're are allowing Magma and FlyingFlip to upgrade the Myth series into the future. MumboJumbo should be blamed. They changed the Myth from cool into laughable with M3.

TheHelmet · Post by **TheHelmet** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 4:11 pm

I don't think MumboJumbo had time to do everything they wanted with Myth, from everything I've heard it was rushed from start to beginning and it's not easy to live up to the 'Game of the Year' series then..

I still think it's kinda lame, but I lay my blame mostly on Take2 for being douches to rush the devs, cause the ruination of a great series.

Orlando the Axe · Post by **Orlando the Axe** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 4:49 pm

lol, mumbo jumber had a development cycle of something like 11 months which was nowhere near enough time to do what they were planning. I beta tested the game and while it had a lot of promise, less than one month before the game went gold I was told "multiplayer isn't in yet"... Take 2 knew the game wouldn't be ready in time and decided to push it out anyway to make a quick buck off the brand name. As soon as the game was released, the entire dev team was fired without even having time to patch the game to a workable state... I think some of the blame has to be placed on Take 2.

The Elfoid · Post by **The Elfoid** » Sat Oct 14, 2006 5:58 pm

Lugas wrote:You can't put all the blame on T2. They're are allowing Magma and FlyingFlip to upgrade the Myth series into the future. MumboJumbo should be blamed. They changed the Myth from cool into laughable with M3.

If MythVillage.org was still alive I'd link you to the articles posted by Santa's Head (the guy who made WWII, from Clan Plaid - yeah he worked on M3). Don't you dare insult that fine fellow.

Lugas · Post by **Lugas** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 3:09 pm

A few more questions:

1) What would happen to TFL, SB, TWA and Oni if Take2 went bankrupt?
2) What would happen to Bungie if M$ went bankrupt (not bloody likely

)?
3) Have Take2 completely forgotton about Myth?
4) Have Take2 completely forgotton about Oni, despite releasing it successfully? (I believe that when Take2 obtained Oni, they hired Rockstar games to release it in 2001)
5) If Take2 had to sell (this could be answered in 1) Myth and Oni (including TWA), would they consider Bungie/Microsoft?
6) Do Bungie have the power to seperate themselves from M$?

Post by **Death's Avatar** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 4:44 pm

1) Whatever take 2 decides
2) The world would end
3) Mostly, except those emails our trusted fanboys hit them with every couple month
4) I less than three Oni. But I have a feeling its in the same boat as myth.
5) Maybe, doubt it
6) They are MS. Bungie wins, MS wins.

-DA

Baron LeDant · Post by **Baron LeDant** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 7:43 pm

Lugas wrote:What would happen to TFL, SB, TWA and Oni if Take2 went bankrupt

I would quickly buy the Myth franchise off them for 1 shiny penny!

Cobalt 7 · Post by **Cobalt 7** » Sun Oct 15, 2006 10:56 pm

Take 2 doesn't care about series of yesteryear, they care about beating up hookers.

Also, if Bungie ever did go under, it's fairly likely the "inner circle" (Jones, Staten, Jaime, Marty, bentllama, etc) would probably go and form a independent company much like a certain fellow went and made a nice Hippo-tastic studio named Wideload.

I'm sure most of the newer employees would either follow Jason and the gang, or go get jobs with other companies. After All, having Bungie on your resume in the gaming biz is what I like to call "Oh Snap!"

(^ Unless of course the company broke apart due to internal politics, inwhich case I'm sure they would all hate eachother for life

vinylrake · Post by **vinylrake** » Mon Oct 16, 2006 1:05 pm

Orlando the Axe wrote:lol, mumbo jumber had a development cycle of something like 11 months which was nowhere near enough time to do what they were planning. I beta tested the game and while it had a lot of promise, less than one month before the game went gold I was told "multiplayer isn't in yet"... Take 2 knew the game wouldn't be ready in time and decided to push it out anyway to make a quick buck off the brand name. As soon as the game was released, the entire dev team was fired without even having time to patch the game to a workable state... I think some of the blame has to be placed on Take 2.

Have to agree with Orlando and Elf - You can't blame the developers for the release of a game BEFORE IT WAS FINISHED.

As a caveat, I never worked for Take2 or the Myth III development team, nor do I know anyone personally who did, so my comments are basically what I remember hearing/reading about the development in forums and articles and comments made by people who were involved.

TakeTwo was the one who made the decision to release the game before it was finished and didn't give the developers the necessary time OR resources to complete the game before release.

I recall one of the developers saying their Mac 'test environment' consisted of ONE single imac - that's the ONLY mac platform they had to do testing on.

I also recall that a whole round of planned user (fan) testing and review and mods was also scrapped by Taketwo because it would have taken too long. The version that TakeTwo released was KNOWn to be buggy and TakeTwo was saying that there would be fixes released in the future even though they had already laid off the development team.

TakeTwo kept the public from knowing the true state of Myth III when it was released by telling the developers that if they didn't keep their mouth's shut about the fact that they had already been fired and that the game wasn't done they would "never work in the game business again". Given that many of the people involved were working on their first high profile professional game 'industry' project, this was a threat that could have had a large impact on their employability.

To add insult to injury, I heard that when the Myth III team was hired they were promised a bonus that they would get shortly after Myth III shipped. Instead they got fired and threatened. Must be corporate asshole speak : "here's your bonus" really means "you are fired".

I am glad that TakeTwo are letting a group of Myth fan/developers fix the things that they didn't care about fixing themselves and letting them enhance the game, but that doesn't change the fact that TakeTwo are not a nice company. I know companies aren't "supposed" to be 'nice' and I am sure I got spoiled by the attitude/personality of the original Bungie, but I still don't like them, they aren't doing anything for altruistic reasons and in my opinion there is no reason to defend them or stick up for them.

Letting MythDev (and inheritors) enhance the game doesn't hurt TakeTwo because TakeTwo retain ALL the rights to the Myth games AND any enhancements that are made. No one but TakeTwo can sell Myth or anything made with Myth. TakeTwo could decide tomorrow that they want to re-release any of the Myth games and they could do so - incorporating the latest builds of any of the games - without compensating or acknowledging the people who actually did the work on the games in the past few years.

The Elfoid · Post by **The Elfoid** » Mon Oct 16, 2006 2:15 pm

vinylrake wrote:Have to agree with Orlando and Elf - You can't blame the developers for the release of a game BEFORE IT WAS FINISHED.

They were fired after it was made then forced to release patches that barely helped it too. They weren't even allowed to fix it up.

As a caveat, I never worked for Take2 or the Myth III development team, nor do I know anyone personally who did, so my comments are basically what I remember hearing/reading about the development in forums and articles and comments made by people who were involved.

I have talked a while back with SH about this stuff a while back, you got the jist of it.

I also recall that a whole round of planned user (fan) testing and review and mods was also scrapped by Taketwo because it would have taken too long.

MWC01 winners were meant to all become testers - 16 more from the best Mythers around (Northern Paladins won it, if you don't know) would have helped testing.

Santa's Head is known to have said his own opus, WWII was infact impossible on Myth III. There's no way he would have let that happen if the team had more time. OK so he was just an artist, but he clearly had some involvement in the dev process.

TakeTwo kept the public from knowing the true state of Myth III when it was released by telling the developers that if they didn't keep their mouth's shut about the fact that they had already been fired and that the game wasn't done they would "never work in the game business again". Given that many of the people involved were working on their first high profile professional game 'industry' project, this was a threat that could have had a large impact on their employability.[/quotet]

They also lied about sales to convince the public it was popular.

I am glad that TakeTwo are letting a group of Myth fan/developers fix the things that they didn't care about fixing themselves and letting them enhance the game, but that doesn't change the fact that TakeTwo are not a nice company. I know companies aren't "supposed" to be 'nice' and I am sure I got spoiled by the attitude/personality of the original Bungie, but I still don't like them, they aren't doing anything for altruistic reasons and in my opinion there is no reason to defend them or stick up for them.
They're not game developers remember. Dev teams usually at least start around a passion for games. Take2 are just a corporation of administration and money.

Letting MythDev (and inheritors) enhance the game doesn't hurt TakeTwo because TakeTwo retain ALL the rights to the Myth games AND any enhancements that are made. No one but TakeTwo can sell Myth or anything made with Myth. TakeTwo could decide tomorrow that they want to re-release any of the Myth games and they could do so - incorporating the latest builds of any of the games - without compensating or acknowledging the people who actually did the work on the games in the past few years.

I think they would need crediting, unsure though.

Lugas · Post by **Lugas** » Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:16 pm

I think Take2 shipping it with the latest builds is unlikely. Plus the only moral thing to do would be to ask Magma/FlyingFlip if the latest patches were included.

Although, if Take2 decided to approve of the latest builds, they would make more money out of TFL/SB because the Mac build won't work on Windows and vice versa. This was already the case for TWA.

If Take2 decided to re-release them (which is very unlikely, unless we all went to their Office and asked them politely), I would like that. Because it would attract new members to the Myth community. Asking MythDev first (provided they decided to use the latest builds) would be nice.

Btw, why has only SB demo been updated? Why can't TFL and TWA demos be updated?

Also, T2 have crippled Myth. Myth III was doomed before it was finished, because it was doomed when it was released because it was unfinished.

Thanks a lot , T2.

Post by **Doobie** » Mon Oct 16, 2006 4:57 pm

the tfl and m3 demos can be updated, magma has only updated the m2 demo cause that's where our primary interest lies, perhaps flyingflip will update the m3 demo, that's their call.

In the unlikely scenario that take2 re-released any of the games, it's highly unlikely they would choose to use the latest builds as they haven't undergone the detailed testing phase that any big company has to go through. I've heard this would cost upwards of $50 000 usd, and t2 doesn't seem to have that much interest in the series.

The Tain

Take 2?

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