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Posted: Mon Jan 09, 2006 4:38 pm
by The Elfoid
WillWall's M3 post made me think...the follower feature from Myth III (where camera 'chases' your selected unit) would be great for Recon (I'm sure people would accuse you of cheating though, so a menu option for host would be needed), and maybe dwarf riot or trowing. Think it over.
Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 2:41 am
by carlinho
hey I don't know if this is possible but it would be great:
have the possibility in FEAR to assign a certain artifact to monsters so they start the map with them incorporated.
example=
I have a soldier unarmed, he picks up a spear and "transforms" into a spear soldier, he picks up a sword and transforms into a sword soldier.
now, you have 600 soldiers on a map:
to make this happen in fear 1.5 :I need to place in loathing 600 soldiers unarmed, 600 spear projectiles on the ground, and then by scripting with unit control give artifact to the 600 units(this means clicking on the 600 spears one by one....)
It would rock if you could assign them with fear, not as ammo (that somehow doesn't behave as an artifact) but as a real artifact that affects the unit immediatelly once the map starts.
Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 2:56 am
by Phex
carlinho wrote:have the possibility in FEAR to assign a certain artifact to monsters so they start the map with them incorporated.
It would be even better if you could set a list of artifacts (like a projectile group) and specify how many of them were picked RANDOMLY at the beginning of the game.
This would allow an impressive possibility: making a group of soldiers of the same type with different weapons. It could be used for a mob of uproaring peasants for example, who carry pitchforks, skythes, sticks, axes etc. Wouldnt that be cool?
Posted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 3:21 am
by Baak
We've been discussing this in a mapmaker thread as I've encountered a need for it as well. Would really open up some interesting possibilities to have this ability, and as carlinho points out is a must for "armed armies".
I can envision a "starts with artifact" checkbox and dropdown list. The artifact could be a "mons override" type in which case the mons would be overridden from the start (i.e. all artifact attributes behave as if the unit just picked up the artifact).
Phex: that's a very interesting idea as well! Wow. Could have an alternate projectile group dropdown so you pick one or the other (a single projectile/artifact or a list as Phex said - could even have the % odds of the projectile from the group be taken from the # or % values there).
Dang... This would be an AWESOME addition to the game and wouldn't change any existing gameplay. 
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 3:26 am
by Shocker
I have no request list because I'm not a mapmaker, nor do I know anything about it, but I answer yes. New stuff is always fun. Isn't it? >_>
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 7:40 am
by Phex
Another idea: what about intelligent units? :O
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 9:29 am
by Industry
Okay, I'll bite. What do you mean intelligent units?
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 12:28 pm
by Welly
iron wrote:Yes, trow bleed in TFL. And vTFL. The dust thing in Myth 2 was a mistake on bungie's part.
It was? Even the puffing hit sound, though, too?
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 3:54 pm
by Baak
Why do Trow crumble to rocks when killed? Why do they turn to stone?
They always struck me as "animated rock" and thus when their life force was too low they froze and broke into chunks of stone when killed.
Trow blood makes no sense to me. Also it seems unlikely Bungie would have such a huge oversight?
And as Welly just said, that hit sound distinctly sounds like some kind of stone/rock being struck.
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 4:36 pm
by Gleep
Yeah I think they shouldnt bleed, but just crumble away.
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 5:00 pm
by Doobie
Baak wrote:Also it seems unlikely Bungie would have such a huge oversight?
lol, bungie incapable of huge oversights?? I think not! take a look at the stuck zerk on dire in TFL that survived not one release, but 4 (1.0, 1.1, 1.2, 1.3)!
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 9:16 pm
I dunno if this is possible, but add in an option so a unit can perform multiple attacks at once. For example, lets say we have a custom unit that fires projectile x at distance a, but once a target gets into distance b, the unit will fire projectile x and projectile y...I've been messing with Fear, and I haven't been able to get this to work because the unit just switches attacks rather than just adding the second attack ontop of the first one.
The main reason I suggest this is because if you can get two seperate projectiles or attacks to happen at once, you could get units that could target multiple enemies at one time (eg. two guns, two seperate targets...), opening up a horde of new unit possibilities.
Another thing, allow an option where units will keep firing at a target even if they're moving, so you could say provide cover fire or shoot back while you're dodging enemy fire or something...
Posted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 9:35 pm
by Baak
Along a similar line though less complicated, I've always wanted to have the ability to pick up something in the middle of a series of waypoints by shift-clicking the object.
Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 8:09 am
by Phex
Industry wrote:Okay, I'll bite. What do you mean intelligent units?
I think we do all agree to the statement that Myth units are not intelligent right now. They react to basic events like
<ul>
<li>defend when somebody attacks me
<li>help my friends near me when somebody attacks them
<li>shoot at anti-missle ememies when I see them
<li>run away from dangerous enemies (like wights)
</ul>
The rest of the time they just stand around waiting for scripting and user commands. They even stand around when you shoot at them with ranged weapons until they are dead if there is no explicit script which prevents this. This is okay so far and works most of the time but its not really cool on the one hand and allows the user to cheat the script with several tricks on the other hand. So I think improving the intelligence of units as an optional feature would be fantastic.
Enhanced to an absurd level it would allow things like...
1) Imagine you had a bunch of advanced commands like Scout, Defend this Ground, Guard this Unit, Draw the Enemy to this Point, Stalk after this Enemy, Heal these Units when they need it, Collect something which is good to throw at the Enemy, Bring this Ball back to my Base etc.
And now imagine your units would execute these commands on their own until you give them a new order. Admittedly, such orders would reduce the need of skill for several actions of course, but single players could control much bigger armies and concentrate on important parts of the game.
2) In scripting it would allow a totally new kind of setting up a map. Some map actions like reinforcements, endgame conditions etc. would stay the same, but instead of telling the cpu units what to do at which time under which conditions, you could just say something like: "This spot is your base. You have no idea that enemy troops are in this territory. Set up your own guards and scouts. When 30 minutes are over, Soulblighter will appear in your base. Come back then and guard him to the world knot over there. Defend his life at all costs.".
Every unit would only know what it can know and decide what to do upon these knowledge including several given parameters like rank, toughness, intelligence, general behaviour etc. For example: "I am here. The enemy is there. My friends are right behind me, but they dont know that enemies are here. I better run back tell them because I am wounded and the emeny is stronger than me." )
If you would add an amount of randomness in the units' decicions, no single player / coop game would be similar to another because you would never know the new plan of the enemy.
3) Instead of only improving their stats, veterans could also improve their intelligence with a self-learning system which remembers situations from previous games and tries to adapt to new situations. User commands as well as executed orders could affect the way a unit would react to a new event. This would mean, veterans really knew when to retreat, at what to aim first and how to avoid several spots on a map when moving around.
To sum it up, it would be awesome in my opinion, but make Myth a totally different game and will never ever happen therefore, also because it would be an immense effort in both planning and realizing such ideas. Its a pity. 
Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 11:35 am
by Archer
Phex: what would be the control scheme for these new orders?
~J